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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Em 24/01/2022 10:49, Henri Alves de
Godoy escreveu:<br>
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About your question "The key questions at the moment would
be; Is there anything that only IPv6 can do?"<br>
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<p>Yes there are several like:</p>
<p>- Avoid any type of NAT and CGNAT which imposes a significant
cost to Broadband ISPs for Capex and Open costs<br>
- Improve end-user experience not having to force them to go via a
bottlenecked CGNAT equipment.<br>
- Move Internet forward by restoring end to end communication as
it should be, etc</p>
<p>Fernando<br>
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<div><font size="4">Abe (2022-01-22 15:27 EST)<br>
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<div>On 2022-01-22 11:21, Henri Alves de Godoy wrote:<br>
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<div dir="ltr">Hi, Abraham !!!
The comments are below ,
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<div>On 2022-01-21 23:12,
Abraham Y. Chen wrote:<br>
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<div><font size="4">Hi,
Henri:</font></div>
<font size="4"> </font>
<div><font size="4"><br>
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<font size="4"> </font>
<div><font size="4">0) My
apologies for mistyping
your name. One of our
team member's English
name is Henry. So, I
just automatically typed
such to address you.<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal">No problem,
no worries. It's very common
for this to happen since I was
a child. ;-) <span></span></p>
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<div><font size="4">1) I
am glad that you
responded, because I did
not receive the
broadcast copy of my MSG
thru LACNOG-Request. I
was beginning to wonder
whether it was properly
transmitted? Since you
appear to be replying my
MSG in private mode, did
you receive a second
copy of my previous MSG?
Please keep an eye on
this one and let me
know, as well.<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Your
messages are not being sent to
the general mailing list, you
must send them directly to <a
href="mailto:lacnog@lacnic.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">lacnog@lacnic.net</a>
. I didn't want to forward
your comments to the list so
as not to commit any privacy
issues.<span></span></p>
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<div><font size="4">2)
Re: Ur Pt. 1): Many
things can be quite
deceiving if one is
looking at only one
angle at a time. For
example, do you know
Amazon has been hoarding
a lot of surplus IPv4
addresses (see URL
below)? If you surf
around the web about
this topic, you will
find more similar
activities by other big
players. Why do US based
IPv6 promoters keep on
buying IPv4 addresses
that are desperately
needed by developing
regions?<br>
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<div><font size="4"> <a
href="https://www.techradar.com/news/amazon-has-hoarded-billions-of-dollars-worth-of-ipv4-but-why"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.techradar.com/news/amazon-has-hoarded-billions-of-dollars-worth-of-ipv4-but-why</a></font></div>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Yes, Amazon
has a large stock of IPv4. I
commented in a post once about
this problem or a centralizing
strategy. They continue to buy
IPv4 because it's an
ever-growing market. Money
issue. See <a
href="https://ipv4.global/blog/july-2021-ipv4-auction-sales-report/"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://ipv4.global/blog/july-2021-ipv4-auction-sales-report/</a><span></span></p>
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<div><font size="4">3)
Re: Ur. Pt. 2):
Again, we need to look
at an issue from
multiple perspectives.
For example, the
starting point is why
was IPv6 designed
without backward
compatibility to IPv4?
I came through the
traditional
communications
industries where such
consideration was the
first rule that a
planner must follow, no
ifs nor buts. As a
result, telephone
subscribers never knew
when a Telco was
upgrading the equipment,
except when one makes a
phone call around
midnight and such
activities happened to
be scheduled.</font></div>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Excellent
question. We should ask Sir
Vin Cerf :-))). Recently in
an interview, he admitted
several mistakes from the past
with IPv4 such as encryption
and a small addressing field
at the time.<span></span></p>
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<div><a
href="https://prensa.lacnic.net/news/eventos-es/vint-cerf-factores-de-exito-de-internet-y-los-desafios-para-los-proximos-50-anos"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://prensa.lacnic.net/news/eventos-es/vint-cerf-factores-de-exito-de-internet-y-los-desafios-para-los-proximos-50-anos</a><br>
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<div><font size="4">4)
Next, do you know that
CG-NAT was developed to
support web search,
video streaming, gaming,
etc. that demand high
volume and fast
response? Who are behind
these? In essence, these
high performance
services pushed the need
for server-client model
with </font><font
size="4"><font size="4">data-centers
distributed to be
close to high usage
regions. Since these
operators do not see
any harm from IPv4
based CG-NAT, why
should they abandon
their investment to go
IPv6?</font></font></div>
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<p class="MsoNormal">In my
opinion, thinking that there
is no harm in CGNAT in IPv4 is
thought towards destruction. I
would not accept or hire an
ISP that offered me an old and
outdated protocol. I would
change ISP. That's what I say
to everyone, including my
students. In addition to the
eternal IPv4 blocks when we
talk about online games (PSN)
when using CGNAT. Changing an
ISP's mindset is difficult and
pointing out the wrong
investment he is making too.
Rapid host identification in
case of an audit or police
investigation. Many
advantages.<span></span></p>
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size="4"> </font> </font></div>
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<div><font size="4">5)
Since English is already
my second language, I
could not read the
beginning part of your
original MSG which I
believed to be in
Spanish, but only
responded to the second
part. I now realize that
you were referring to a
fresh article on
theRegister that I had
already read the APNIC
blog that it cited.
Allow me to make a
disclaimer so that our
discussion will be
meaningful and
transparent. That is</font></div>
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A. I lead a team that
has done further work
along the vein of the
over thirteen years old
IETF Draft by APNIC
mentioned by their
current blog. You will
find our latest IETF
Draft at:</font></div>
<div><font size="4"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font size="4"> <a
href="https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-chen-ati-adaptive-ipv4-address-space"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-chen-ati-adaptive-ipv4-address-space</a></font></div>
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</font></div>
<div><font size="4"> B.
Also, our work has been
granted US Pat. No.
11,159,425.</font></div>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I am
Brazilian and I speak little
English and Spanish. I didn't
know about this draft. Thanks
for sharing and I will read
with great care and attention.
Excellent work and
congratulations on the patent
acquired. Sorry for the
question, is it worth
investing in any study or
change in IPv4, a protocol
that is no longer standard?</p>
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During the above study,
we navigated through a
lot of uncharted
territories and waters
to formulate our
solution. So, please
pardon my analyses and
opinions that may not
conform to current
general views. <br>
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<div><font size="4"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font size="4">Regards,</font></div>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Different
points of view are important
and I appreciate that very
much. Thanks for sharing.<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Best
Regards,</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Henri.</p>
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<div><font size="4">Abe
(2022-01-21 23:11 EST)<br>
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<div>On 2022-01-21 14:54,
Henri Alves de Godoy
wrote:<br>
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<div>Hi Abraham,
thanks for replying
and for the
comments.</div>
<div><br>
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<div>1) Yes, the
interview really
does not classify
into sub-categories.
We know that the
biggest ones like
Google, AWS,
Facebook, already
have ipv6-only
datacenter.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>2) Yes, let's say
that since the ISP
made an investment
with CGNAT that in
my opinion made a
"wrong decision", it
is clear that he
will want to
protect. But the
adoption of IPv6
goes beyond a simple
new protocol. Its
adoption is
strategic for its
survival as well.
Currently delivering
CGNAT with IPv6
(dual stak) is the
most common
approach. Investing
in IPv4 and buying
more IPv4 address
blocks has no
future.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards,</div>
<div>Henri.</div>
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<div dir="ltr"
class="gmail_attr">Em
sex., 21 de jan. de
2022 às 12:29, Abraham
Y. Chen <<a
href="mailto:aychen@avinta.com"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">aychen@avinta.com</a>> escreveu:<br>
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<p><font size="4">Hi,
Henri:</font></p>
<p><font size="4">1)
Perhaps if you
could make a
distinction
between who are
behind the IPv6
and who are
behind the IPv4
CG-NAT, the
subject will
become clearer.
That is, they
are both Big,
but in separate
sub-categories
of Tech
companies.</font></p>
<p><font size="4">2)
There is nothing
wrong about
protecting the
investment for
the sake of at
least including
the consumer.
Pushing new
technology from
the perspective
of the innovator
is
narrow-minded.<br>
</font></p>
<p><font size="4"><br>
</font></p>
<p><font size="4">Regards,</font></p>
<p><font size="4"><br>
</font></p>
<p><font size="4"><br>
</font></p>
<p><font size="4">Abe
(2022-01-21
10:29 EST)</font></p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Message: 1 </p>
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<pre>Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2022 09:24:22 -0300
From: Henri Alves de Godoy <a href="mailto:henri.godoy@fca.unicamp.br" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><henri.godoy@fca.unicamp.br></a>
To: Latin America and Caribbean Region Network Operators Group
<a href="mailto:lacnog@lacnic.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><lacnog@lacnic.net></a>
Subject: [lacnog] Big Tech's use of carrier-grade NAT is holding back
internet innovation
Message-ID:
<a href="mailto:CALRKgT49U50hRii8mhNcFpP+mHEVpm0R=tX4a+3Vs+afXu5H0Q@mail.gmail.com" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><CALRKgT49U50hRii8mhNcFpP+mHEVpm0R=tX4a+3Vs+afXu5H0Q@mail.gmail.com></a>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Buenos dias !
Compartilhando a entrevista sobre preocupações sobre a adoção do IPv6
<a href="https://www.theregister.com/2022/01/20/ipv4_nats_slow_ipv6_transition/" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.theregister.com/2022/01/20/ipv4_nats_slow_ipv6_transition/</a>
Chamam a atenção os destaques:
"Carriers and Big Tech are happily continuing to use network address
translation (NAT) and IPv4 to protect their investments......."
"We are witnessing an industry that is no longer using technical
innovation, openness, and diversification as its primary means of
propulsion"
Saludos a todos !
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