[Ietf-lac] [lacnog] Fwd: ietf meeting fees

[Lee Howard]

On 6/27/19 10:35 AM, Fernando Gont wrote:
>> What would you think if an organization hired a few people to
>> participate, and summarized the important issues? Maybe a membership
>> organization, where the members would decide which issues were most
>> important, sponsors would prepare webinars to explain the technologies,
>> and staff would summarize key issues to members, and describe key
>> considerations to the IETF?
> Certainly that would be great, particularly if that helped support
> ongoing work  -- as opposed to just have these people be read-only.
>
>> Staff could not represent members - that's not how the IETF works
> Well,  this one is debatable: folks use their affiliations everywhere,
> don't they?  ;-)

Yes, and saying you're from a large organization does help with 
credibility. But many people with no major affiliation have credibility.

But there are two activities. When trying to change a document, 
credibility matters. When trying to find consensus, numbers matter. One 
person representing a hundred still only gets one hum or one post for or 
against a draft.


>> With a little help from people within the region, like you and Carlos
>> and maybe some of the local organizations, the effort could be
>> maintained in several languages.
>>
>> Would this help, or would it dilute the contribution of people in the
>> region?
> Anything that can help some people engaged is of value.
>
> As noted above, I think it is important that folks attending don't
> simply attend, but actively contribute.
>
> I don't want to populate the meetings with people from the region for
> the sake of it, but rather make it possible for the region to contribute
> work to the IETF.

Exactly!

I think the assumptions about the Internet are different. People at the 
IETF forget that the Internet is mobile devices, not computers. They 
don't understand how latency and packet loss and in some places power 
loss are important factors in Internet operations. Internet connectivity 
from an island, or from a land-locked country, is managed differently 
than the North American, European, or developed Asian countries.

Of course I also think that most people at IETF don't understand how 
networks are operated. For instance, I once had an argument with someone 
saying, "Yes, that other proposal is better, but let's adopt this one 
now, so that ISPs can deploy it, and they can change in six months to 
the other one." I had to explain about vendor development time, and 
testing upgrades, and maintenance windows, and slow rollout. It was a 
revelation to the participants.

There are lots of arguments like, "We should write this in an RFC so 
network operators have to do it." They are simply wrong, of course, and 
it is tiring to be one of so people telling them the IETF is not the law 
giver to network operators.


>
>
> Thoughts?

Many. I will let you know how we're doing with the organization I suggested.

Lee


>
> Thanks!
>
> Cheers,