[lacnog]         Subasignación de prefijos a otro ASN y el tema con los RoA

[Rubens Kuhl]

I'll let John Curran reconcile some of what he said about ARIN in
different fora, but let me remind you that you are saying that about
all 3 pre-ICP-2 RIRs: RIPE, ARIN and APNIC. And only one of them not
being true breaks your point, or even just one allocation not being
able to lease breaks it... as I repeated a number of times, each block
will have its own ok/not-ok result, and that uncertainty is part of
the leasing process.

No concession, mate.


Rubens

On Fri, Feb 4, 2022 at 6:27 PM Mike Burns <mike en iptrading.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Rubens,
> " As far as I now, unfortunately in ARIN there is not currently impediment
> to lease ARIN non-legacy blocks."
> Fernando just acknowledged that renting ARIN RSA space is not a problem, yet
> you persist in your delusions.
>
> Sounds like you're unwilling to share your investigation results.
> If you are going to complain about them why not make them public?
>
> I think you should concede on the legacy issue. You lost.
>
> Regards,
> Mike
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: LACNOG <lacnog-bounces en lacnic.net> On Behalf Of Rubens Kuhl
> Sent: Friday, February 04, 2022 4:09 PM
> To: Latin America and Caribbean Region Network Operators Group
> <lacnog en lacnic.net>
> Subject: Re: [lacnog]
>         Subasignación de prefijos a
> otro ASN y el tema con los RoA
>
> > Your pet-project investigations sound like a good idea.
> > Will you please reveal the results of your investigations here for
> > others to learn from?
>
> Actually, the main focus is to file complaints with the respective RIRs for
> each one found to be suspicious, knowing that most of the time only the RIR
> will have all the necessary information to make a determination.
>
>
> > Of course we know that many cloud providers advertise blocks belonging
> > to their clients, not themselves, and they advertise them under the
> > cloud provider's ASN.  AWS, Cogent, Oracle, Vultr, etc. Not sure how
> > you would differentiate those from leases, but with enough
> > investigation you are sure to find smaller, non-cloud provider ASNs
> > advertising space belonging to others.
>
> Actually, the first false positive that came to mind was DDoS mitigation
> services.
> Most of them have a bad habit of advertising their customer prefixes
> originating in their ASN.
> I saw one case of a cloud provider advertising a client address space once,
> and they changed that quickly when they knew they were in violation of their
> allocation.
>
> > If you would agree to non-disclosure I will share an ARIN non-legacy
> > block being leased by a Latin American client off list as I believe I
> > can acquire their permission. They know they are breaking no rules
> > leasing ARIN RSA space.
>
> A non-disclosure could put me in a situation of malfeasance if I bump into
> something wrong or possibly wrong and then fail to report or investigate it.
> So thanks, but no, thanks.
>
> > You still say non-legacy space is not safely leasable, but you can't
> > point
>
> No, I say that it is not safely leasable wholesale. Every block will have a
> different safety profile.
>
> > to any policy or RSA language that prevents RSA addresses from being
> leased.
>
> Because leasing is not the issue, how it is used is the issue. For instance,
> by leasing to a network that has not been verified by the RIR to have real
> need is now using those resources, now there is no verification of such
> need.
>
>
> > Only in LACNIC and AFRINIC is there a risk, not that I've ever heard
> > of LACNIC addresses revoked for usage differing from the original
> > justification. Maybe you have?
>
> I can only talk about generics here that most compliance processes of ICANN,
> RIRs and NIRs provide opportunities for fixing a breach of contract before
> it goes public.  Saying more than that would violate professional duty.
>
> > If what you say is true (that non-legacy space can't be leased), where
> > is it in the RSA or the NRPM of ARIN, RIPE, or APNIC?
>
> Again, this will be different block by block and the point is not the lease,
> but the subsequent usage by the lessee.
> It is also dependent on the policy manual and RSA in force at time of
> allocation.
>
>
> Rubens
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